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-   -   For those who throw stones at Alice ... (http://www.alice.org/community/showthread.php?t=1119)

DickBaldwin 12-21-2007 01:23 AM

For those who throw stones at Alice ...
 
For those who insist on throwing stones at Alice, my response is simply: Fine, go use Java 3D.

However, switching from Alice to Java 3D may require you to expend a little extra up-front study effort. For example, you may want to begin with the following tutorials:

[B] Java 3D API[/B]
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/other/article.php/3622246"]1540[/URL] Understanding Lighting in the Java 3D API
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/article.php/3701536"]1541[/URL] Back to Basics in the Java 3D API
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/article.php/3704116"]1542[/URL] Digging a Little Deeper into the Java 3D API
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/data/article.php/3706721"]1544[/URL] Simple Animation with the Java 3D API
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/other/article.php/3709341"]1546[/URL] Understanding the Alpha Time-Base Class in Java 3D
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/other/article.php/3712226"]1548[/URL] Combining Rotation and Translation in Java 3d
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/other/article.php/3714626"]1550[/URL] Understanding Transforms in Java 2D
[URL="http://www.developer.com/java/other/article.php/3717101"]1552[/URL] Understanding Transforms in Java 3D

Dick Baldwin
Free Alice tutorials: [url]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/tocalice.htm[/url]
Free programming tutorials: [url]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/toc.htm[/url]

RAGE 12-21-2007 03:24 PM

Unbelievably sorry
 
[QUOTE=DickBaldwin;4356]For those who insist on throwing stones at Alice[/QUOTE]

:( [SIZE="4"][COLOR="Blue"][B]Dude, I am so sorry I went all out like that. It's just that I have searched a lot for something like Alice, and when I found this program and something wrong happened... I guess I sort of just took it out on Alice and the crew.
So sorry[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]:(

DrJim 12-23-2007 07:10 PM

I certainly don't have the same experience that Dick has regarding Java 3D. However I would be very cautious doing any Java-based advanced graphics if I was planning to make money on it. I've been recently trying to get a Java-based program called Moviestorm ( [url]http://www.moviestorm.co.uk/MSDB/HomePageServlet[/url] ) to run - unfortunately it seems to have the same memory demand/memory leak/garbage collection problems as Alice (and, for that matter, Open Office).

The Jave virtual machine concept is great as a teaching tool and maybe has great appeal in academia - but if I had to develop something right now I would, reluctantly, go with the .net framework - and to heck with the Mac and Gates-phobic Linux fanatics.

DickBaldwin 12-23-2007 08:58 PM

[quote=DrJim;4367]However I would be very cautious doing any Java-based advanced graphics if I was planning to make money on it.[/quote]

Alice is strictly a teaching tool. My emphasis wasn't on developing software for profit. That wouldn't be very feasible with Alice [I](but some folks do make a profit developing with Java)[/I]. My emphasis was on learning how to program.

If someone doesn't like Alice as a teaching tool, they can simply roll up their sleeves, learn a great deal about real object oriented programming, and use Java 3D as a teaching tool.

[I](Actually, I was really being a little sarcastic and trying to make the Alice critics come to appreciate what Alice does has to offer as opposed to what it doesn't have to offer. Programming in Alice is extremely easy. Programming in Java 3D is extremely difficult.)[/I]

Dick Baldwin
Free Alice tutorials: [url]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/tocalice.htm[/url]
Free programming tutorials: [url]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/toc.htm[/url]

DrJim 12-28-2007 05:38 PM

[QUOTE=DickBaldwin;4370] ...Programming in Java 3D is extremely difficult.
[/QUOTE]

Programming and making a profit is probably the most difficult of all :) - though I'm sure I don't have to tell you that.

tullygray 07-24-2008 09:56 AM

I have to use Alice for the course I'm studying, and I cringed when I saw it used Java. I have a thing against Java :)

I do like the look of the program though unfortunately under linux 'click and drag' isn't working. That's probably a problem with my setup. Does it use GTK? It looks like it. My system isn't configured very well for GTK since I prefer QT and KDE.

I learned to program 3D graphics with openGL and C, using a cool little library called GLFW to do input and window handling. I would recommend going down this route if you are really serious about learning to program. Serious 3D programming is not for everyone!

DrJim 07-24-2008 08:06 PM

[QUOTE=tullygray;6145] with openGL and C [/QUOTE]

Using "Open GL and C" can be either a generic comment or an actual statement of fact. If the latter - please at least look at C++ or C#. OOP really does have a lot of advantages - I doubt any major programming project these days (unless maybe it was very data base intensive) would take another approach.

tullygray 07-27-2008 04:17 AM

Yes I know. Now I do use C++ and I'd have to agree. I'm only using Alice 'cos my course requires it. Recently I found that java 1.6 on gentoo doesn't run Alice properly. However 1.4 seems fine. I got that tip from another linux based thread. :)

javajava 07-31-2008 05:01 PM

Im a little Disappointed
 
I heard about Alice through a friend and also in Randy's lecture. I'm learing java right now and I thought it would be cool to download the software, so I did. The application is cool, don't get me wrong, and no offense to anyone that worked on it, especially Randy, but I'm not really seeing how you can learn to program, aside from the "methods" tab on the screen. Maybe it's just me, but idk.

DickBaldwin 07-31-2008 10:27 PM

[quote=javajava;6229]I heard about Alice through a friend and also in Randy's lecture. I'm learing java right now and I thought it would be cool to download the software, so I did. The application is cool, don't get me wrong, and no offense to anyone that worked on it, especially Randy, but I'm not really seeing how you can learn to program, aside from the "methods" tab on the screen. Maybe it's just me, but idk.[/quote]
Replicate the Juggling Judy world at [URL]http://www.alice.org/community/showthread.php?t=1570[/URL] and the Alice War Zone video at [URL]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WwQI7dPiAw[/URL] without looking at the code and then tell me that you can't learn anything from Alice. Once you reach that level, I will put more stock in your opinion than I do at this point.

Dick Baldwin
Free Alice tutorials: [URL]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/tocalice.htm[/URL]
Free Scratch tutorials: [URL]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/tocHomeSchool.htm[/URL]
Free Java/C#, etc. tutorials: [URL]http://www.dickbaldwin.com/toc.htm[/URL]


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